Woven clique.
A chat with Vincent Gross, one half of Los Pashminas.
Last year was the first time I visited Fribourg in over 10 years. One of the first areas that I have explored In Switzerland when I started Dee Dee’s Picks. Since this was my first time meeting people involved in the Helvetian creative scene, it was thrilling to see a community getting built on creative projects and taking initiative in hosting spaces for expressivity. On one side, I got invited to play at TRNSTN radio, co-founded by Nicola Marthaler. On the same day, Ablette records, situated albeit not shadowed in Fri-Son, as co-founded by Vincent Gross. Feeling welcomed. Invited as an observer to a scene that has been building up stronger thanks in part to the aforementioned two.
As early supporters of the Dee Dee’s Picks journey, the feeling is well mutual. Following them around throughout the year at gigs of theirs in Switzerland, their curated sets comprised of eclectic oddities left me appreciation for thoughts of intertwined diversity. Track lists derived from a hunger for obscure sub genres and forgotten B-sides, as well as keeping a grip on authenticity in promoting music from within their vicinity. To the beautifully curated night of Ablette’s anniversary in Fri-Son. To early morning chats outside of Kauz. Or even moreso to head banging in strobe-lit- smoke-filled rooms of Kapital Bollwerk, have all been moments of witnessing the vivacity of the Swiss scene, present and there.
To make a full circle; from a year later that we first initially met, it is my pleasure to tell their story. Parts of this cultural identity is fused between the two record nerds under their pseudo: Los Pashminas. A bit of a household name for some, an unearthed gem to others. The music in this record is an ode to early trance, with nods to early 2000 breakbeats, slowed down with adulations of space rock and other soundscape driven reminiscences of Goa music. Enlaced with ideology of mysticism, communal thoughts and self-care.
The pashmina is a shawl type clothing whose best use is to fashion and regulate the temperature of your body. It also shares the name of a Fribourg-based duo; consisting of Vincent Gross and Nicola Marthaler. Rather than being seen as a traditional duo, they are self-described as a support group. Supplying each other with unearthed tunes and meeting in the middle to showcase a sound derived from years of diligent music curatorship.
Music affiliated veterans of the Fribourgean scene, their contributions are best observed within their various activities. For one, Nicola co-founded TRNSTN Radio, a broadcasting station whose identity is enthralled by being a place for creation, gatherings, experimentation and reflection. Vincent as the other, enriches the scene as a member of the committee of legendary statused Fri-Son, as well as having co-founded Ablette Records with his partner.
The music behind drifting in a sea of intentions is something of an ode to their eclectic music taste and blithe personality. Influences of proto-trance, early goa and nods to 2000s breakbeats as familiar references that are wrapped with a contemporary twist. A departure in sound from their previous works, the focus of this release is reflective of their heterogeneous sets; psychedelic soundscapes, downtempo oddities, soaring bass lines and care-free melodies. The sonic pallet weaved together by these two music seamsters has generated the wildest harmonic reverberations. Los Pashminas, a combination of materials to make a soft, yet sturdy piece of clothing. A suitable metaphor to underline their idea of a cathartic understanding of when to push and when to let go. An amalgamation of their domesticated exotism of obscure music, style and comfort, pseudonymised by these two characters. In this chat titled "Woven clique", we talk about the hardships of musicianship, external stimulations in the creative process and the positive reinforcements of being in a creative community.
Los Pashminas, live at KAPITEL Bollwerk. 07.12.23
“It’s been ten years that I am doing what I do. I dedicate my soul, time and life to music and the arts, which is why I enjoy diving into various music industry related endeavours. Most of my projects revolve around producing, DJing and playing in a band. But really, there is no time stamp on when I started my musical journey. As early as 15 years old, I have enjoyed partaking in the scene, such as being a production intern for the Amalgame in Yverdons-les-Bains as an intern. It is vital for my well being to commit in these domains. It’s compulsive for me. All or nothing. The element of spontaneity is what drives me. That no two performances, events, sets are the same. Playing with or for people. You know, once you get the taste of performance or the thrill of organising a successful night, it is difficult to come off of it. These ideas of communicating through music. To exchange thoughts through a set or evening without necessarily having your own voice is very powerful to me. These sentiments that you feel when producing music and projects translate into thrills and excitements. When all in all, it is just air movements and harmonies that are just an idea of exchange. Calls and responses.
My first attraction for electronic music is clearly the sonic side of it and hearing sounds that tickle the neurons or grooves that naturally carry you away towards the desire to move. The impulsivity to dance. Yes, there really is kind of a subliminal work that happens through what you hear to get you moving, to get you thinking in an altered state for composition of music.
Regarding a defining moment that struck me in all of this was when I was first able to play full length songs on the guitar. This idea of being capable and to reproduce a track but from your own interpretation really struck a chord in me (pun intended) and really launched my musical journey from there on in.
I also believe that the social experience of clubbing mixed with the types of sounds that are released in this environment evokes the question of “Why do I like it?”. This question comes up because there is a whole set of parameters which goes beyond the music, such as the place, the people, the diffusion, its delivery and the way in which it is done…. I also have a sort of addiction of finding myself in such environments where it unlocks a lot of things in me. It's very therapeutic in a way.
When it comes to my creative endeavours, I also like to explore different horizons. You noticed that when it comes to what had previously been released on Subject To Restrictions Discs. If I had to define this record in regards to music genres, I would use descriptions like instrumental music related to Space Rock. I find that there is something perhaps diegetic in my music. What I try to do is comparable to how a movie director would proceed in making a shot of a very particular scenery. A sort of movement, maybe vibe, if you will. It’s kind of a similar process in how a director needs to fill in the shot, whereas I interpret it as filling in the frequency spectrum. It's not so much that I have a focus on respecting fundamental musical concepts in the likes of making harmonies work with thought-out rhythm sequences. I would say that I am very inspired and have a drive to create an atmosphere, space, similar to what one would describe as notions of ambient music.
I feel that within the creative journey, I have to release parts of my soul in every creative output I make. It’s very personal, very intense, and is required for me. It’s funny because I have made the comparison to friends before that for me, creating art is a bit like the “horcruxes” in the Harry Potter series. You immortalise yourself by disseminating fragments of your soul in these pieces, and thus for myself, into my work. You give something of yourself for the sake of longitude. For some people, there is this aspect of puzzle solving when it comes to making music. Myself, having a scientific background in academia, has this sort of subconscious backbone in my creative endeavours. Perhaps better described as ambivalence. There is something very cartesian in me. An aspect of problem solving in my creative methodology where I connect the dots through logic, a sort of formula or equation. When I am testing arrangements, I try to give it a geometric form to see what I might be missing and to further see how I can enhance my approach when it comes to building tracks, whether it is by counting bars or seeing if the used instrumentation fits in the frequency spectrum or not. It’s quite comparable to the same way that you’d test an equation, a formula, the approach is applied in a similar fashion to my tracks.
I have a very erratic way to produce music. There are no defined phases for me. There are periods where I produce a lot, where I learn a lot, and therefore I would sum it up to that. Curiosity is my drive. This is for me, perhaps why I do not differentiate my approach to making music whether it is in a band or on my own. If the project interests me, then it is in my instinct to seize it as a way to better my musicianship. Despite having a sporadic workflow, my motivation also comes from people. Even when I do things on my own. I cannot exclude the human element from this. There is certainly a part of the process that is taken into account so that I can extract something from it and thus myself and therefore receive a sense of gratification from the completion of a track for example. This said, I believe that I am someone who produces quite simply. I've had a lot of movement within projects, so I want to work with a fairly minimalist set up. I work a lot with the guitar which is my first instrument. I use it a lot in my productions and I think it's where I can bring a very personal touch to the music. I also like to sample a lot of things, whether it being hardware or field recordings, I always like to try new ways of production. Since I can be pretty lazy, I'm a fan of less is more. I trust myself for that and I believe that having also now heard a lot of music over the past few years, the more you're exposed to it, the less of a specific formula becomes apparent. By now, I kinda know where my limits are. That's also why I work with engineers to mix my songs. In this case, Noémi and Manu from Suoni Speziali did an outstanding job. Since I started making music, I think it's the fact of coming from instrumental music and having played in groups that the matter of trust is anchored in me. Having the need to put it in the hands of people who have more experience than me in certain areas. I know that all my energy has been put into writing and producing and then, it must progress technically. You can make a painting, but you give a framer to put the frame around and a gallery to showcase it. Delegation is key.
When coming to the intentions of each of my musical pieces, I think that I always manage better to describe them after their completion. The choice of names behind the titles are linked to things that I experienced or read, that allow me to pinpoint them at moments of my life upon the music’s genesis. I don’t want to neglect the fact that my personality appears on these tracks, in the sense that I wish them to stay somewhat playful by giving them funny names. After all, it's still dance music and people must be able to spend a certain moment of pleasure. It’s important to recognise that they can be playable in clubs and that it is fun for people who hear them, with an intention that might be a little bit deeper in allowing us to solidify that thought.
But on that note, I’d like to say that I don't like making music for the sake of making music. There needs to be intent behind it. The thing with the mathematical approach of mine that I mentioned earlier is that I can also apply it to all of my creative projects, such as DJing. It becomes intuition and second nature. However, I need to be careful, as anticipating too much means that I don't get to the desired result. Music for me after all, is an exercise of knowing how to let go of things. Where it is producing or mixing, there is something that comes up of me that i don't necessarily understand or have control over, but that I trust and give into. Of course, this is an ongoing process. It’s not a perfect recipe. I believe it is the case for many people involved in the music industry, one way or another. For a long time, I was basing myself too early on in the creative process on the opinion of others, asking friends for feedback, when I should have been more intuitive and confident in my own work. I think that was a big part of why it took me a while before releasing something. Freeing from such constraints, worries, was necessary for me to really develop my sound, since before that, it was in expectation of what people feel I should sound like. I mean of course, another big factor is the need now to meet deadlines. In this case, releasing via Dee Dee’s Picks, gave me the necessary motivation and thus was focussed enough to write an album for you. Despite it being very turbulent and busy in my life during these past few months. But then again, when does it not? You just need to make it work at some point. It pushed my creative process and boundaries much further, albeit it being intertwined with anxiety. It’s self-installed confidence. Like many things in life, it’s a continuous process of work. The thing with this newly attained focus is that it can be emotionally draining. You don’t think or feel it as much upon the completion of a record. Only then it becomes cathartic. And because it is so important to retain your personality in your creative endeavours, it is important for me to retain this aspect of amusement. It does not reflect me otherwise. What’s the point of creation then?
Currently, I am working in a kitchen as a side job and I find that the idea of making music has a very similar approach to making dishes. It’s not because you fuck up a plate that you will forever be shit at it. The point is, you go back to where you messed up, adjust, and become better. It is ridiculous to go from the premise that because you made a bad meal that you will never make another one again. Therefore you have to monitor what you are doing, see where it works and understand why you like it. Where it goes wrong, you adjust to betterment. In relation to music, you can’t expect that the next track will be your best or worst one. Your first or your last. It’s just a continuous process of extension. It goes again to what I was saying before in regards to my love of music; curiosity. You never know what will come out of you next. It’s important to stay within the perpetual action without necessarily predicting the final result. You can repeat making the same dish fifty times in one service and still mess it up. Nothing stops you from starting it again and making it to your standard. An error does not define the rest of your journey.
There is this idea of having the imposter syndrome as a result of this. A sense of lacking legitimacy. I believe that owning my record store was an immense help in getting continuous influences for producing different kinds of music. DJing as a duo with Nico is also a source of inspiration. You get context feedback and synergy of combining different genres and thus you get new ideas all of the time. You get exposed to so many different kinds of music that you have a repertoire of ideas and loops in your head. The trick is to know how to channel and pull out such ideas when needed, which is not always an on/off switch. Besides laying down sketches, I like to apply techniques, such as creating synthesiser patches, that I learned that day and see how I can structure them in a song. Some people need to run everyday to expend their energy. Myself I need music to be able to detach myself and translate my inner thoughts into sonic pieces. Reflection only comes afterwards. I think it was in the Ableton book that there is a quote that said “compose drunk, edit sober”. I like that theory. I believe that we must absolutely not lose the idea that it is an activity with which we must have fun moving forward. So we sort of organise our lives around that too.
The EP that I released on Subject To Restrictions Discs was a huge stroke of luck to me as well as being quite the revelation. I was enormously surprised to be able to release this EP in such a short time. The great fear that followed is that once I’ve released these handful of tracks, the bar was already raised. I can't lower it for the second one and thus, a fear takes places of disappointment in not meeting one’s expectations. A one time wonder, in a self-depreciative sense. Tinged with a lot of fears and anguish of just not being able to do it. Not finding a story to tell. Not coordinating a certain quantity and time of music through several patterns, several things, several intentions that are irrepressible. Getting caught up in this thing and thinking, “It doesn't mean anything, it's useless, it sucks”. These questions are constantly nearby and can become reality, but I supposed it is something you do not necessarily get used to, but you familiarise yourself with and thus find strategies to lower these inner voices down.
Labels or event promoters kind of evolving and dissipating, synonymising better with the idea of collectives, I do not see Nico and I in this case as a duo, but more so as a support group. I think the engine of all this with Nico is that I have met someone with common ground where I can evolve with. It's a matter of reinforcement. I think the idea of advancing together is because we realise that we have a lot of self-definition and reassurance on a creative level, but also have a lot of fun seeing each other grow and evolve as artists. And in fact, I think we want to do more to which we give each other this opportunity and to some extent, responsibility in monitoring each other's potential. We want it to be more generally speaking a part of our lives. It's kind of like a bromance. There is this side where the emotional core has a lot to do with it. Despite having our respective life paths, we are friends above all. We are both immersed in wonder within this musical world. This world of sharing, the idea of a musical journey, of discovery, of taking people who want to listen to us a little within different mental spaces. Los Pashminas really comes from this. Two troubadours on a mission of self-discovery and reassurance. I don't want to denigrate the very serious side behind it. It’s important to find fun and enjoyment in all of this.
So, I think we keep doing that, but I think it's pretty awesome that just human interaction can lead to all these things. I don't know if I could do it on my own. I tried for many years to produce, to look for labels, whereas finally, I created a Bandcamp page during the pandemic where only after this traction took place, I had many tracks on my computer just sitting there and me giving myself a goal to finish them. But with intent. There must be a thought process, a medium.. and despite it gaining visibility through paid for premieres and the likes, I also felt a great emptiness behind. Mainly because it was only me who was alone behind this journey. I am someone who likes to work and live with people. Emotional connection is the engine of many adventures, whether for music, for work, for relationships, for... I don't know. For me, every element of connection with another person is a single element. There's no one else but me and the person who can go through this. So I try to pay a lot of attention to that. This engine also continues to push me to discover things, to make music, to organise myself in life in order to continue my activities. Collaboration is a very, very powerful matter for me.a
I think it's also pretty awesome to be able to say that with different skills, we can grow together further. Whether it be with Nico or other people. I find it's a world where sharing life stories between each other is fundamentally part of the spirit of Los Pashminas. From the moment you make music, you try to express a very deep feeling, be it emotional, political, social or religious. Certain types of music genres in my life where I started to understand them how they can be shaped with and without intention. Not to binarise things too much, but in any case, I suddenly found myself presented with these deep intentions which were made and which were beneficial for me. I think going in search of sounds and emotions really made me feel the healing power of it all. I've made this commitment that somehow I want to have my place in it and I'm operating on opportunity. I work on my patience because obviously, sometimes, I find that things go too fast in my head and not fast enough in reality. Having worked with other people helps create a bit of that buffer and not wanting to rush too fast and too far. I think it's therapeutic.
I'll say lastly that my intention is not to go as “high as possible” but “to play on the long game”. Therefore the longer I am doing what I do, the better I become at my craft. Opportunities like being the only independent record store in the city in which you live and to not only inherit but contribute within the musical community in Fribourg is enormous in responsibility. Especially being situated in Fri-Son, has been a privilege to not be overshadowed and owed to their legacy, but also by being able to form and contribute our own identity with my partner Laura. There are also other extremely interesting projects around us that have developed within the scene, as Nico would tell you with him being a co-founder of TRNSTN Radio. There is perhaps an arrogance behind it too I believe, but not an ill-intentioned arrogance. It's really something to feel proud of doing something at times alone, but always supported. I don't want to use the word "ego trip", but there is clearly something egoistic behind it and a desire to do something unique, no matter the entailed cost and the challenges. We found ourselves thinking that we were in the right place and at the right time to do it but when in reality, it is more likely due to the people behind us that served as the backbone in emotional support to do so.
There is a lot of self-awareness and knowing your place in the community that becomes implemented simultaneously. For instance, there is the obvious backlash of being very frontal and going ahead and saying, “Here, now we're going to do it like this, the way we want to”, by projecting your ideas. However, the self-awareness aspect comes from the first day we opened the shop with Laura. By having this moment of consciousness that as of tomorrow, Ablette Records no longer belongs to us, but to the community. It's like giving birth to something, but it's not us who are going to benefit from it. We're going to let other people benefit from it and if we want to have the privilege to stay there over time, we’d need to learn how to let go. Like having your own child, it forms its own identity and path. The core is there, yes. But for the rest it becomes out of our control, unpredictable, which is beautiful to us. The child is going to be influenced by everyone they meet, every life choice they make, everything they do that happens to them. Whereas Ablette mirrors exactly this premise. But above all, it's about finding yourself a working environment where both of us feel good, where we can contribute something.
It’s important for us to also bring a kind of musical buffer space where everything is open. When you find yourself in this record store, it's a kind of neutral zone where there is no better music than another. It was so important to distinguish the fact that Ablette’s crates would not become “Laura’s and Vincent’s playlists' ', but rather something that everyone, anyone, could find themselves in. Referring back to the idea of arrogance, it just comes to the point that after a while, yes we are music curators and yes, we are good at it. No shame, to which we can only hope to transfer our knowledge and make aware to people that there is a lot of good music out there, regardless of their level of niche. It would be selfish to retain all of this information to yourself. It is our job to showcase music, not to ourselves. I cannot stress enough the importance of sharing as a fundamental ethos of my life. We are not describing that one scene is more important than another. Even someone who doesn't buy records, being in a place where you see so many different kinds of music, so many different artists, I think there's something in the subconscious that makes you really take a step back on all that, to which you tell to yourself "Wow, there are still a lot of intentions that are laid down in the idea of being creative. That the music expresses certain emotions''. We wanted to bring that environment to Fribourg. I believe that the social intention behind it is really to show that there is nothing more deserving than another person. Everyone can have their place in an environment like this.”
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